Spiral: From the Book of Saw marked a new start for the beloved Saw franchise when it premiered earlier this year. For once neither hide nor hair was seen of Tobin Bell's infamous Jigsaw, save for the iconic spiral marker that his successor took on. In fact, for the first time, said successor had no direct connection to Jigsaw and was simply inspired from afar.
William Schenk, played by Max Minghella (The Handmaid's Tale), appropriated the spiral symbol and the "trap" methodology for his own specific vendetta. But while Samuel L. Jackson's ex-police captain was the target of his fury in the film, the door was left open for enmity to persist between himself and star Chris Rock.
Spiral: From the Book of Saw arrives on Digital July 13 and on 4K Ultra HD, Blu-ray, DVD, and On Demand July 20 from Lionsgate. Minghella spoke to Screen Rant about the extensive preparation he did to embody Schenk as well as where he hopes to see the horror franchise go next.
Warning: this article contains spoilers for Spiral
Screen Rant: I heard that you first heard about Spiral through Chris Rock without even realizing that's what he was talking about. At what point did you realize your role in the project, and what made you want to jump on board?
Max Minghella: I'd heard about this project and them maybe being interest in me doing something in it. But I had no idea what the take of the film was going to be, what the angle was, or what the role was going to be. I did sort of assume that I'd be a pizza delivery boy who gets his head chopped off or something. Which, by the way, I was very excited about.
I didn't have any expectations. I just love Chris; I've always loved Chris, and I knew that he was involved in the project. And I love franchises; conceptually, I love the idea of them and the challenges of them. Something about Chris and this material was already so compelling to me. But I'd have been very, very happy to have shown up and taken out the trash at the end of the night.
When I got the script, I saw that not only was it a really wonderful part that was very exciting and challenging as an actor, but that the most exciting part was the genre place it it lived in. I really grew up on genre films with high stakes that also had a sense of humor to them and weren't one one tone. That's the best way of articulating it: often now, movies tend to exist in one tonal space.
The films that I grew up with didn't have that self-seriousness. People could die, and it could mean something emotional; you could be invested in characters, but people were allowed to smile. I just missed movies like that. I'd been watching a lot of movies like that anyways when I got the script, and it was literally that. It felt very serendipitous.
When you got the script, at the part where you quote-unquote die, did you already know that wasn't the case? Or were you like, "There I go. Oh, wait, I'm back."
Max Minghella: Much to the frustration of the producers. I love whodunits, and my mother is an Agatha Christie nerd. I kind of knew, because I know the things to look out for. I didn't really know, but it didn't throw me either. It was pretty clear to me from the outset that he was going to be the killer.
You mentioned the different tones of the story, and yours is a multifaceted role. How do you approach playing the perfect partner and the puppy wanting to tag along, yet at the same time maintaining who Schenk is underneath?
Max Minghella: I can tell you it is, by a wide margin, the hardest I've ever had to work. I really worked hard on this, and that's not something I can say about everything. It was a lot of blood, sweat, tears and thought. I really was excited and cared about this project. It's the kind of movie that I would go and see, and you don't always get to do stuff like that. Whereas this movie, I know I would have been at opening weekend if somebody else was playing my part. Because of that, I really was energized.
And I think what's interesting about it is that the character I'm playing is doing what the movie is doing. That's what I kept talking to Josh [Stolberg] and Darren [Lynn Bousman] about, how the movie is is lying to you about what your expectations are and William is doing the same thing.
So, a lot of the work was about how the movie was presenting this relationship. To me, it needed to feel like we were earnestly investing in these two people. Some of that stuff is performance, and a lot of it is also honestly working on the script a little bit and working within the scenes of how we're presenting the movie to people. Because I felt like we had to completely commit to that card. "This is what it's gonna be. It's gonna be a movie about Schenk and Banks solving crimes, and Schenk's probably gonna die because he's too sweet."
I wanted to fully commit to it. The character shares the manipulation with the movie, and that's very meta.
How did you develop that dynamic with Chris Rock to express that admiration and yet manipulation throughout?
Max Minghella: I can't speak for Chris, but my experience of it was that in the script, there was much more friction between these characters. And the friction also occurred over a much longer period of time in the movie before they started to get along.
We quite naturally got along very comfortably off the bat - and there was actually quite a mutual respect there, I would say. Maybe he was just pretending, but it felt like we did have a sort of "thing." The tension went away quite quickly, and I felt that a lot of things became way more interesting. Because what happened in the movie is that, almost by the time you get to the subway station - which is our second or third scene in the film - you can see that they are starting to connect to one another, and are actually functional.
Even though that was not really planned, I would say that it gives so much more weight to the story. It makes it so much more interesting than if the whole movie was in line with theirs. Like right, right, and goals are emotional.
Tobin Bell's voice is an iconic part of the Saw franchise, so hearing the computer-generated voice for the Spiral Killer was disconcerting to me at first. It makes sense by the end because you would give away the game otherwise. But would you have wanted to take a stab at a voice manipulator yourself?
Max Minghella: I have a lot of respect for the Saw family. These movies are made by a pretty intimate group of people; they're a family, and they know what they're doing as they foster this. With one of the highest-grossing franchises of all time, coming into this space, I think there's certain elements of the franchise that you really want to leave it to the experts.
I did not feel it was my business to get involved in that conversation. I trust their instincts over mine when it comes to what the Jigsaw voice should sound like, or what the masks should look like. My job is much more to take care of the things we've talked about before, which is the transition between these two people.
William was obviously inspired by Jigsaw. Do you have your own favorite Saw film, and did you do any rewatching to research Schenk's inspirations?
Max Minghella: Yeah, for sure. I definitely rewatched them all. It's a huge responsibility, again, coming into this movie with the implications of the role. That's another reason I worked harder now. I really felt a responsibility to not try and emulate something that has come before.
Tobin Bell is such an extraordinary actor, and he has this weight and presence - all of these things that I couldn't even pretend to have. It'd be embarrassing if I tried to emulate any of that, so I never tried to. I think they are quite different talents, so the decisions I made and the execution of them made it very different.
And Saw II is my favorite, to answer your question.
Before we get into the gory horror elements of the film, which Spiral does very well, you already mentioned that Zeke and William have those classic buddy cop tropes that lull you into a false sense of security? What do you find most appealing or inspiring about both those genres?
Max Minghella: They're both so fun, and it was quite literally switching off between the two. It did feel like I got to play two people in the same movie. Again, I love all movies and all kinds of movies, but I don't think there is a genre I love more than the cops on a case where you're allowed to laugh sometimes. Beverly Hills Cop and Die Hard; these are DNA movies for me that shaped a lot of not just my ambitions as an actor, but sadly my ambitions as a person.
I watch Beverly Hills Cop at least once a week still. I'm always amazed when I put it on just how much of my idea of masculinity is based on that movie or my idea of friendship and teamwork. It is probably not a good thing that I've been so affected by fiction in my life.
Given the state of our union today, some people might be understanding of William's anti-cop vendetta. Would you say that you felt any responsibility or moral obligation when it comes to toeing that line on screen? Did you guys have any offscreen conversations about those real-life implications?
Max Minghella: I love when a villain isn't just acting blindly. That was really important to me, and I think it's essential to these kinds of movies working. It's not just that the guys want some money. When a villain has a compelling point of view, it's a much more compelling story.
Obviously, the doors are left wide open for a sequel, and the war between William and Zeke is perfectly poised to continue.
Max Minghella: It's sort of like Christian Grey and Ana at the end of 50 Shades of Grey, when the elevator doors close.
Then I cannot wait for Spiral Darker. What other aspects of William would you like to see explored in a sequel?
Max Minghella: I don't know if I'm allowed to say that. I do have something about the character that I'd like to play, which they know about. But who knows if we'll get to make another one. I really hope we do, because it was so much fun to do.
Like you said, I think there's real opportunity to keep going. But that's out of our control. It's going to be about whether there's an appetite for it, and people actually want to see us. But, certainly, we'd be happy to return.
With the home release coming, are there any parts of the film or any other characters that you would want people to pay attention to on a rewatch - that maybe you'd hope to pay off later?
Max Minghella: I think it's a really, really watchable movie. I love rewatching, and I've seen it many times. I am always getting something new out of each time I watch it.
I love how unpretentious the film; it's really tongue-in-cheek and is very self-aware. And I think it's a really fun romp. So, there's not something that specifically I want them to watch, but I hope it's a movie that people have fun throwing on, watching with their friends and laughing.
You recently directed Teen Spirit, which was an ambitious directorial debut. How has that affected or changed your perspective as an actor?
Max Minghella: I appreciate the hours of a director now. Actors work much longer days than directors, and that was my big takeaway.
No, look, I am very lucky to get to do different things and wear different hats. I enjoy doing all of them; they're really different. It's hard to necessarily say how one informs the other. But I guess in a bit of a schizophrenic way, playing Schenk in Spiral feels that way. Sometimes I feel like I'm putting on different hats.
I'm a real workaholic, which is probably one of my downfalls is as a person. And I only know about movies, though I don't know about anything else at all. If you showed me a map, I wouldn't be able to name any of the countries on it. But I know a little bit about movies, and I love movies. So, as long as I can stay busy and getting to engage in this medium, then I'm very happy.
Season 4 of The Handmaid's Tale has ended, and it still has everyone hooked. What does the future hold for you? Can you say anything about how June and Nick are doing?
Max Minghella: Well, we're doing the season 5. I think I can say that, because it was announced in March. I'm really excited about it, and I'm so proud of season 4. I think it's the best season we've done - I don't know if I should say that. But I really thought it was such a step up from a show that was obviously already fantastic.
I was very moved when I watched season 4. I was so proud of everybody's work in the difficult circumstance of shooting during a pandemic. Elisabeth Moss: what a beast. She's just so formidable and fearless; she led us through this crazy situation, and then ended up delivering the best season yet.
I'm so excited to go back to it. You never know what's going to happen from episode to episode. That's the fascinating thing about television, because you're discovering it with the audience every episode. I love playing this character, I always find some fun in it, and I'm just very grateful for this job. And I'm already lamenting the day that we're gonna have to stop.
Spiral: From the Book of Saw arrives on Digital July 13 and on 4K Ultra HD, Blu-ray, DVD, and On Demand July 20.
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